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Author Topic: Temporary Receptor Alternative  (Read 11903 times)

bjames

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Temporary Receptor Alternative
« on: August 23, 2007, 02:03:18 PM »

I'm playing a pig roast this Saturday with the Zendrum exclusively.  While my ultimate goal is to purchase a receptor and run BFD on it (I already have BFD and the XFL and Deluxe expansion packs), I just cannot justify the expense right now.  So, as an alternate strategy to obtain a more realistic drum sound, I purchased EZDrummer and Addictive Drums to run on my laptop.  Right out of the gate, I loved Addictive Drums especially with the ability to shape the sounds by manipulating various effects.  I did try EZ Drummer but wasn't as impressed with the sounds of the Claustrophobic kit by comparison.  Although to be honest, I haven't spent a lot of time trying to tweak it.  Partly because of my first impressions of AD and partly because of the limited time available to prepare.  I do plan to revisit EZDrummer at a later time.

I'm running AD on my Dell Inspiron 9300 w/100 gig HD running at 7200 rpm and 2 Gig of Ram (it also doubles as my work laptop).  I'm using a Mackie Onyx 400F for my midi interface/external sound card to my Peavey 10USB mixer.  From there I run the left output to FOH and the right to my Mackie SRM-450 which serves as my personal monitor.  I've been really please with this setup in rehearsals. 

Bottom line, I do believe Receptor (specifically The Freddy) with BFD is the way to go for me...eventually. Addictive Drums gives me more realism than my TD-3 or TD-10exp does.  Note: Addictive Drums does not 'officially' support e-drumming in regards to have a 'humanize' feel to eliminate machine gunning at max velocity, but supposedly they are working on that for a future release.

So, if you're looking for a temporary fix until you can afford a Receptor, perhaps this information will be of some use.  I'll let you know how the gig goes.

Brian

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Geosphere

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2007, 02:37:43 PM »

I have a question for the general populous here:

Why does everyone want to sound more like real drums? 

You have an instrument that is NOT real drums.  If you want the real drum sound, couldn't you maybe... play real drums?

I'm truly baffled by the quest for real sounding drums by Zendrummers.  Its like buying an electric guitar and then buying tons of pedals to make it sound like a hollow body acoustic.
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bjames

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2007, 04:06:00 PM »

It's all a matter of perspective Geo.

Yes, I could bring 'real' drums for the gig, but frankly, I don't want to haul all that gear, and spend the time to set it up, place the mics, tune the drums, only to have to tear it all down and haul it back home.  I purchased the Zendrum (in part) to replace my drum kit for gigs such as this.  In addition, we are playing rock cover tunes from the 60's to the 90's and I want my Zendrum to sound like a professional mic'd acoustic drum kit.  Given that objective, I much prefer the sounds of sampled drums to that of the Roland modules.  Not to say that I get to stand out front and sing a few tunes in addition to wandering among the audience while playing my 'drums'.  A 'real' kit would not allow that.

Do you think the majority of V-drummers out there are playing Vdrums because they want that 'V-drum' sound?  No, they are trying to mimic some kind of acoustic kit but they want the other advantages that come with owning a set of Vdrums or they want the ease and convenience of playing through a module.  Yet Vdrums are not 'real' drums.   Geo, I know that the Zendrum is not a real set of drums, that's not this issue here.  The real beauty is that I can mimic the sound of real acoustic drums if I choose to.

If I were playing in a band where we were going for an original, experimental, new age, and/or industrial sound, then I can choose any number of sound sources and not be limited to something like Addictive Drums.  But in this case, creating a more realistic mic'd acoustic drum sound is what is desired (for this gig).  But maybe the next music project will call for more creative and non-traditional sounds.  That's the beauty of the Zendrum...isn't it?  The freedom to do what is desired or called for? 

No offense, but I'm a little baffled myself by your response...being that you are an Administrator and long time Zendrum enthusiast.  ???

Brian

Brian
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Geosphere

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2007, 04:38:38 PM »

No offense, but I'm a little baffled myself by your response...being that you are an Administrator and long time Zendrum enthusiast.  ???


I just have no desire to play fake drums.  Zendrum is something else.  It seems quite limiting to stay with drum sounds. 

http://www.toohipfortheroom.com/Imagine%20(THFTR).mp3

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bjames

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2007, 05:00:08 PM »

I think you may have misunderstood my position.  I'm not limiting myself to just drum sounds.  Perhaps for this gig I am but I am also very early in my midi education process so....one step at a time. Rather, I am about using whatever sounds are desired for a given musical adventure...which I understand is different for each individual.

The purpose of this thread was to inform others that there is a more affordable alternative to the Receptor (that works and sounds quite well) for those who have expressed an interest in it but who can't afford to shell out $3000....strictly meant to be informative.  I get your point, you don't want to generate 'real' drum sounds with your 'non-drum' instrument.  That's cool.  However, I  would just add, why limit yourself that way?  ;)  Why not keep open the possibility that one day, some day, you might actually want to trigger an acoustic drum sample?  Makes no difference to me and more power to you.  After all, we all get to choose.  Just because you don't understand why someone would choose to trigger an acoustic sample doesn't mean it's wrong.

Respectfully,

Brian
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Geosphere

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2007, 06:37:09 PM »

Why not keep open the possibility that one day, some day, you might actually want to trigger an acoustic drum sample?

There's definite acoustic drum samples in the example above.  I never said it was wrong.  I just don't understand the fascination with making an instrument a complete acoustic copy of another.
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THUMPER

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2007, 08:18:59 PM »

Right or wrong what I am searching for is software or module that will give me the greatest distance from soft to loud. Dynamics is almost missing in amplified music these days. Listening to the radio everything is compressed so its all at the same level , so playing out I personally would like to be able to play my instrument to the highest level possible for me. It is an individuals choice and I think that there is room for many different choices in what you would like to sound like,  including like a real acoustic set. Keep in mind though thru the years I have heard some  really bad sounding drum sets out there, so for me there would not be any incentive to head in that direction but certain style songs it would be nice to sound  like an acoustic .  Geo and bjameson thanks for sharing your views and Geo that mp3.  The choices are unlimited  The search goes on THUMPER
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Zennerman1

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2007, 09:29:21 PM »

I have a question for the general populous here:

Why does everyone want to sound more like real drums? 

You have an instrument that is NOT real drums.  If you want the real drum sound, couldn't you maybe... play real drums?

I'm truly baffled by the quest for real sounding drums by Zendrummers.  Its like buying an electric guitar and then buying tons of pedals to make it sound like a hollow body acoustic.


I've wondered the same thing myself. The focus has been too much on real drum "emulation". Why call them "electronic drums"? That's why the old simmons sounds and other analog type sounds are coming back. I'm not saying you can't use real drum sounds, but why not explore other sounds?
My  .02

Cheers,
Steve
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duojet

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2007, 09:32:07 PM »

totally disagree. its more like buying a roland keyboard and wanting it to sound like real pianos, organs, or an orchestra. one reason many zendrummers prefer the heavily multisampled "real drum" software programs are the response and dynamics of the acoustic instruments. the change in sound and timbre as you go from soft to loud. few artificial/electronic instruments have this type of response.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2007, 09:46:12 PM by duojet »
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MustangMick

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2007, 07:55:16 AM »

A couple of my friends are raving about the new "Nashville" refill set for EZdrummer created by session drummer Harry Stinson. Some very realistic Acoustic Drumsets if that is what you are looking for.

http://www.toontrack.com/ezx.asp#nashville

EZdrummer is also a lot less taxing (particularly for Laptops) compared to some other Drum Software packages.

Cheers
Mick
« Last Edit: August 24, 2007, 08:01:46 AM by MustangMick »
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bjames

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2007, 08:05:58 AM »

A couple of my friends are raving about the new "Nashville" refill set for EZdrummer created by session drummer Harry Stinson. 

I just purchased the Nashville refill based on some reviews I've read.  I'm going to take a look at it after Saturday's gig.  The reason I purchased EZD and AD is because they were reported to be less demanding of resources on a laptop than say BFD or DHFS.  I do own BFD, but I can only run it successfully on one of my desktop PC's....which is fine for recording. But in a live setting, I'd rather take a laptop or a Receptor when I chose to fork over the extra cash.  One of the other advantages (for me ) of getting the Receptor is that it will eliminate one more thing for me to carry (laptop) although it'll add some weight to my rack case  :-\ 

Brian
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Geosphere

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2007, 08:36:56 AM »

But in a live setting, I'd rather take a laptop

This thought always terrified me.  Have you ever had any problems bringing a laptop to a gig?
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bjames

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #12 on: August 24, 2007, 09:08:43 AM »

But in a live setting, I'd rather take a laptop

This thought always terrified me.  Have you ever had any problems bringing a laptop to a gig?

I meant as opposed to taking my desktop PC tower...sorry I didn't make that clear.  I am taking my Roland module as a backup because yes, I am aware of the problems that are inherent with using a laptop for live use.
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Zenfem#9

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2007, 10:21:16 AM »

I would guess that we all have different needs and wants in what we're looking to get out of our Zendrum.  Personally, I wanted a drum kit I could play with my hands standing up.  A couple af bad ankle breaks stopped me from playing the kit the way I want.  Now I can do double bass easy as pie.  I was also looking for something portable. 

It's pretty cool to have drum sounds as realistic as bfd.  It's also cool to be able to play electronic kits, exotic percussion, synths, or whatever else you want to run the zen through.

My current band appreciates more realistic sounds.  Other projects might lend themselves to other setups. That is what's so great about the Zen, no limits.

Raven
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bjames

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Re: Temporary Receptor Alternative
« Reply #14 on: August 24, 2007, 10:34:14 AM »

Exactly!
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