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Author Topic: Inconsistent triggering  (Read 3473 times)

doud

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Inconsistent triggering
« on: June 30, 2006, 10:06:38 PM »

I was recently playing a gig with my Zen, and the trigger I use for my snare seemed to be fading out on me occasionally. Most of the time it seemed fine, then it would drop out for several measures, then come back. No matter how hard or soft I hit it while it was gone, I would either get no sound (ie: did not seem to trigger), or a very low level of sound (like a very light trigger). Seems like I have a flaky contact somewhere for that trigger, but thought I'd better ask before opening it up.

Any ideas of what to look for as the problem source before I perform open heart surgery on my Zen ? Are there any repair parts available. This is an old Muse, so not sure if the components used are the same as current models.
 
Any advice welcome. I am fairly technical, so not afraid to get right into the guts for repair if required.

Thanks!
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john emrich

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Re: Inconsistent triggering
« Reply #1 on: July 01, 2006, 12:11:11 PM »

I too have had this happen.  But, it was never anything on the inside. 

I would try to re-seat the trigger.  Gently push the trigger down and make sure that you don't push to hard.  With most of the triggers on the Zendrum, you will end up hitting them in the same spot.  Sometimes that is not center  and over time will cause the trigger cap to shift on the rubber grommet.  A gentle push down on the trigger will center the the plastic piece on the top and may fix your problem.  I have found this helpful.

John
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John Emrich
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retro surfer

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Re: Inconsistent triggering
« Reply #2 on: July 01, 2006, 05:26:32 PM »

I Agree the caps get shifted sometimes on the pads and cause some very slight binding nothing gentle adjustment has not fixed.  don't know if the Muse is the same though I had one originally but did not have the problems as much as my laptop does but I play the laptop harder.  good luck
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jeff sanders

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Re: Inconsistent triggering
« Reply #3 on: July 03, 2006, 02:47:31 PM »

a few times i noticed that my hats were faded volume even though my toms, snare, bass drum volumes were not affected.  i use dmpro.
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ZENTASTIC

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Re: Inconsistent triggering
« Reply #4 on: July 04, 2006, 10:19:55 AM »

I had this problem about a yr ago.
My Midi jack wire had a very small cut in it on the plug in on the inside
I had an electronics guru fix it for me very easily.
hope this helps.

ZENTASTIC-ROBIN
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Jaay

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Re: Inconsistent triggering
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2006, 11:07:25 AM »

I seem to be having a similar issue.  It's not a problem per se, but I'm always interested to know what's going on with my machines.

My R2 trigger has two main functions for me: I use it for the closed hi-hat sound in my jazz map, and I was experimenting with using it as my ride cymbal for my general-use trap set map.  When I'm using it for the HH sound it works fine, no problems at all, nice and clean, volume right where I want it.

Now, when I tried to set it for use as a ride, I started having issues.  I set the trigger for the same Note Number as I usually use for my ride cymbal, so it's transmitting the same note information, the same voice, everything, but the volume and the tracking aren't nearly as good as they are with my main ride pad.

I could think of two reasons why this would be the case: I'm somehow touching the pad at a different angle when it's a ride than when it's a hi-hat, or somehow the trigger cap got mis-aligned somehow.  Evidence doesn't point to either one: my hand seems to be in the same place for both occasions, and I reseated the trigger cap. 

As I mentioned above, this really isn't a problem for me since the primary use for that pad is working quite well, but I don't like having unknowns in my rig.  Any controbutions are appreciated.  Thanks!

-Jaay
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"Batman Purple" ZX, Roland TD-9, MIDI Solutions Footswitch Controller, misc. triggers.

john emrich

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Re: Inconsistent triggering
« Reply #6 on: July 28, 2006, 05:55:01 PM »

If I understand you correctly, the only difference is the actual voice that you have selected.  If so, check your mute groups.  HH sounds are often in the same group which allows you to close the open HH sound with a closed sample.  If this group is on, your ride cymbal sound will act weird.


Hope this helps,
John
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John Emrich
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Jaay

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Re: Inconsistent triggering
« Reply #7 on: July 29, 2006, 04:45:52 PM »

I will check that, but I don't think that's the problem.  The inconsistencies I'm describing are occuring between different maps in my Zendrum and different Patches in my DTX.  Why don't I just write it off as an apples-to-oranges scenario?

In the Patch I'm having a problem with, the trigger that has the "right" ride (T4) is transmitting (for the sake of argument) Note Number 51.  When I changed the note on the R2 trigger I mentioned, I changed it to also transmit Note Number 51, so if it was a problem with my Alternate Groups, I should have encountered it already.  Thus, I think the issue I'm having is coming from my trigger and not my module. 

I'll check out the Alt. Groups in the interest of exhaustive research, but I think I still need to entertain alternate theories.  Thanks!

-Jaay
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"Batman Purple" ZX, Roland TD-9, MIDI Solutions Footswitch Controller, misc. triggers.

doud

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Re: Inconsistent triggering
« Reply #8 on: October 01, 2006, 08:59:06 AM »

fyi, I believe I have solved my original problem. I finally took the back cover off my Zen and after tracking down the wiring for that trigger, noted that the wire used for it on one of the connectors was actually being pinched between the back cover and another component (wire appeared to be flattened somewhat). I simply shifted the wire away from the component and no problems since then! This might explain why it was so inconsistent (perhaps when I pressed the Zen - and its back cover - against me when I was playing, this pinch caused that connection to go flaky).

Happy drumming! :)
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kbour

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Re: Inconsistent triggering
« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2006, 07:44:03 AM »

I just received my brand spanking new ZD (LT version) and am absolutely loving it.   ;D

I have one slight problem:  On only 1 touchpad (#96 originally), I don't have the same sensitivity as all the other triggers.  It seems that light touches do not register very well.  I have to hit it pretty firmly in order to get a sound.  I have that trigger assigned to closed hi-hat on my TD-20 but, when I try to do a finger roll, every other note sounds.   I have that same MIDI note assigned to trigger #72 (opposite side) and it works perfectly, so I know the sluggishness is in the ZD and not the Roland TD-20.   I tried pressing the black button down a bit, but it had no effect.  I am afraid to do any more physical manipulation without some guidance from the experts. 

Thanks,

Ken
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Ken Bour, Northern Virginia
Current Equipment:  Zendrum LT, TD-20 VDrums, Musser M-75 Vibes, JBL 15" EON G2's w/ 18" JBL Sub, Roland SC-D77

kbour

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Re: Inconsistent triggering
« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2006, 05:53:09 PM »

David Haney explained to me this afternoon that the rightmost edge trigger on the ZD Laptop version shares circuitry with the foot pedal insert, which is set internally to a floor of 10 (I think) vs. default=4.  That particular trigger, then, is designed to have a bit less sensitivity.  I guess "floor" is similar to "threshold" in the TD-20. 

There is nothing wrong with the instrument and no physical manipulation of the trigger is required.  David did assure me that those triggers are nearly indestructible, so don't be concerned about pressing them -- even firmly.  He said that I could bang it hard with my fist and it wouldn't do any damage to the piezo.  Anyway, I'll take his word for it, but it's good to know that the unit is built to withstand some handling.   

For that particular trigger, I associated a different patch/sound that will not require finger rolling, so all is well. 

Ken
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Ken Bour, Northern Virginia
Current Equipment:  Zendrum LT, TD-20 VDrums, Musser M-75 Vibes, JBL 15" EON G2's w/ 18" JBL Sub, Roland SC-D77

duojet

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Re: Inconsistent triggering
« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2006, 02:32:48 PM »

David Haney explained to me this afternoon that the rightmost edge trigger on the ZD Laptop version shares circuitry with the foot pedal insert, which is set internally to a floor of 10 (I think) vs. default=4.  That particular trigger, then, is designed to have a bit less sensitivity.  I guess "floor" is similar to "threshold" in the TD-20. 

There is nothing wrong with the instrument and no physical manipulation of the trigger is required.  David did assure me that those triggers are nearly indestructible, so don't be concerned about pressing them -- even firmly.  He said that I could bang it hard with my fist and it wouldn't do any damage to the piezo.  Anyway, I'll take his word for it, but it's good to know that the unit is built to withstand some handling.   

For that particular trigger, I associated a different patch/sound that will not require finger rolling, so all is well. 

Ken


hi, are you able to change the noise floor for that pad back to the default or 4?
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kbour

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Re: Inconsistent triggering
« Reply #12 on: December 10, 2006, 09:31:04 AM »

hi, are you able to change the noise floor for that pad back to the default or 4?

Duojet:

Setting the floor (FL) is a global variable on the ZD and the default is 4.  That last trigger and the foot pedal share common circuitry and, based on David's explanation, it cannot be made more sensitive than 10.  Evidently, the foot pedal required a higher floor setting than the default, but it was set internally and cannot be changed by the user.  David suggested pressing the trigger into the unit quite firmly so that it is seated as tight as possible against the piezo.  He thought that might help a bit.  I tried following his instruction, but that trigger is just not as responsive as all of the others to light touches.  I have it set to OpenHH for now and that seems to be working OK.  I wouldn't set it to any patch/sound where you need lots of fast/light dynamics.   It would be fine for Crash, Kick, and maybe a few others.   As David mentioned to me, the laptop model has an extra trigger, so maybe we should think of that one as a BONUS!   ;D

Ken
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Ken Bour, Northern Virginia
Current Equipment:  Zendrum LT, TD-20 VDrums, Musser M-75 Vibes, JBL 15" EON G2's w/ 18" JBL Sub, Roland SC-D77
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